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PODCAST

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine

Life is full of difficult things, from tiny everyday disappointments to life-altering events. Everyone’s at least a little bit Not OK, something grief expert and psychotherapist Megan Devine knows from the inside out. In wide ranging, insightful, deep conversations, Megan talks with people about their often invisible losses - and what they’ve learned about being seen and supported in difficult times. With guests pulled from the front lines of entertainment, medicine, education, and activism, the

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All Episodes

56:38

The Old Gays Talk Life, Joy, and the Missing...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/10/23

Being fabulous can save your life. The Old Gays are a social media sensation: flamboyant outfits, lip synched dance parties, and risque theatrics you might not expect of men in their 70s and 80s. A lot of their media attention focuses on the joy they bring to all of us. But in their new book, The Old Gays’ Guide to the Good Life, they share a deeper story. This week on It’s OK, Bill, Bob, Mick, and Jessay talk about the missing generation of gay elders, and how being “discovered” late in life

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50:32

A Place Called Home: A Conversation with Child...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/10/16

The scene is 1990’s New York City. Young David Ambroz and his two siblings are homeless, sleeping in bus shelters and bathing in public restrooms, under the care of his mentally ill mother. The child he was is still evident in the person he grew up to be: a nationally recognized expert on child welfare, and a staunch supporter of the foster care system. This week on It’s OK that You’re Not OK, we discuss both the horror and the joy of his childhood, landing on a vision of hope for the future that

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60:45

Overachieving As a Cry For Help: with Laurel Braitman

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/10/09

Lots of smart, high achieving people learned to greet pain with stoicism: by being mature and responsible, even as kids. But what happens when you can’t maintain the facade of having your sh*t entirely together? Do you ever get to be less than Super Human? In this episode we cover: Perfectionism as a coping mechanism for all kinds of emotional wounds Is distraction bad for you? When the worst has already happened, how do you control your anxiety? Is there any good way to tell kids that

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65:34

Such Ferocious Beauty: with Margo Timmins of the...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/10/02

Dementia means losing your person over and over again. Margo Timmins and her siblings watched their father lose pieces of himself for years. They processed all that loss the way they always have: through music. The Cowboy Junkies vocalist joins us this week to talk about love, memory, and the ferocious beauty of turning towards what hurts. *not sure who the Cowboy Junkies are? Google “cowboy junkies sweet jane” - I bet you’ll instantly recognize her voice. In this episode we cover: The

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67:03

Cruelty on Steroids: How We Talk to Each Other, with...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/09/25

We fight hard for the things we believe in. But HOW we fight for those things causes more damage than we realize. Jameela Jamil is a lightning rod for criticism, but it’s not just how people treat her that she’s concerned about. “The most punk thing I can do is move towards love and unity.” - Jameela Jamil In this episode we cover: Our odd habit of dehumanizing each other in the name of “progress” Do we believe, fundamentally, that human beings are allowed to change and grow? What kids

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47:17

Why Do We Celebrate Trauma (aka: Resilience)? with...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/09/18

Did anyone teach you that understanding your grief is the key to being (or becoming) a healthy human being? Probably not. In this expansive episode, Megan speaks with world-renowned author and physician Gabor Maté about the role of trauma and grief in our personal lives and in society at large. Dr. Gabor Maté on grief, this week on It’s OK that You’re Not OK, the podcast. In this episode we cover: What is “personal agency” and why does losing personal agency create disease? Why calling

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61:32

Sorry for your loss: comedian Michael Cruz Kayne

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/09/11

How do you turn the worst thing that’s ever happened to you into a comedy show? Comedian Michael Cruz Kayne went viral for a tweet he posted on the 10th anniversary of his newborn son’s death. What followed was an outpouring of support, but also: of storytelling, with thousands of people sharing their own experiences of loss. His one man show, Sorry for Your Loss, and his podcast, A Good Cry, have made the topic of child loss a little bit easier to approach. He’d like you to know you should

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70:16

Elise Loehnen: The 7 Deadly Sins and the Crown of...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/09/04

Should you stop being “good”? According to the 7 deadly sins, a “good person” needs no rest, has no appetite, has no desires, puts themselves last, and is never upset. NYT best-selling author Elise Loehnen says we spend most of our energy denying the needs and instincts that make us human - like our needs for love, connection, success, and rest. It’s hard to be “ok” when you’ve spent a lifetime denying your own needs. In this episode we cover: How the 7 deadly sins morphed into a

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67:54

Tembi Locke: From Scratch

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/08/28

Tembi Locke lived an amazing love story: she met a handsome chef during a study abroad year in Italy when she was just 20 years old. They moved to LA to pursue Tembi’s acting career, and built a life around their love of food, family, and each other. And then leiomyosarcoma arrived. Is it still a Hollywood love story if it doesn’t have a happy ending? Check out the best selling Writing Your Grief course here.Train with Megan here: next course begins 9/04 In this episode we cover: Who’s the

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59:14

Sam Sanders: Life Has Been Lifing

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/08/21

Sam Sanders is a well known and well loved radio and podcast host. He went a little extra-viral for a recent episode of his show, Vibe Check, in which he and his co-hosts openly discussed grief. This week on It’s OK, Sam joins us to talk about being open with his grief, and the ongoing relationships we have even after death. In this episode we cover: What happens if you give grief a voice? The double-edged sword of church communities Why understanding context helps you treat yourself more

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60:22

Steven Kotler: Peak Performance and Getting Older...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/08/14

When life feels hard, does “peak performance” mean anything? Steven Kotler is known as the NYT best selling author of books like Stealing Fire and The Rise of Superman, but can the science of stretching limits apply to grief of any kind? If you look beyond the slick language of bio-hacking and extreme sports typically found in discussions on peak performance, it turns out there’s something here for all of us. In this episode we cover: How peak performance applies to your life - even if

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62:30

adrienne maree brown: Can We Give Ourselves...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/08/07

What if there’s nothing to fix? What if you could just, you know, be yourself - whatever that looks like today? When I told people that this week’s guest was none other than adrienne maree brown - the excitement level was off the charts. adrienne maree brown is the author of Emergent Strategy and Pleasure Activism, among other works, and she’s instrumental in opening conversations about bodies, power, grief, and change (personal and collective). This week, it’s all grief - and it’s all love

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54:22

Horse Barbie & Cultivating Trans Joy with Geena Rocero

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/07/31

Can you hide in plain sight? From trans beauty pageants in the Philippines, to the catwalks of New York City fashion week, to the Ted Talk mainstage – Filipina-American model Geena Rocero has lived an astounding life. This week on It’s OK that You’re Not OK, the author of Horse Barbie: A Memoir shares what it costs to suppress your true self in order to find safety and success, and why joy is powerful medicine. Geena Rocero is a trans advocate, speaker, and author of the new book, Horse

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53:45

Book Bans, Grief, and Love: What Do These Have to Do...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/07/24

Whether you’re interested in social justice or not, there’s no denying the grief simmering beneath the surface of daily life. It’s in our personal lives, it’s in the news, it’s in our communities. The thing is - we never really talk about it: just how much grief connects us. If we learn to lean into that grief together, we might really create the beautiful world we all long for. Malkia Devich-Cyril knows grief from the inside out. They grew up knowing their mom would die of her illness. They

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66:09

Real Self-Care with Dr. Pooja Lakshmin

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/07/17

Have you ever put on a face mask, expecting it to solve all your mental health problems? That seems… unrealistic, but that’s what self-care marketing tells us: get your self care right, and all your difficulties will evaporate. This week, Dr. Pooja Lakshmin breaks down what “self-care” actually means when we’re living in a complex, capitalistic world. It’s an exploration of grief, burnout, and exhaustion, and what it takes to care for yourself inside systems that repeatedly ignore their part in

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51:20

Is There Any Good News On Climate Change? with Bill...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/07/10

We’re in a massive climate crisis, but it’s hard to think about it, isn’t it? It’s a great temptation to shut our eyes to climate change. It’s overwhelming. This week on the show, climate activist and author Bill McKibben on facing the reality of the climate crisis, understanding what needs to change, and what you can do - not just to change the course of humanity and the planet, but to feel more hopeful and connected as this all unfolds. In this episode we cover: Is halting climate change

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63:41

A Renaissance of Our Own: The Stories We Tell...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/07/03

Can grief be an opportunity for growth and self-understanding? The answer, of course, is yes: but it’s a bit more complex than that. This week, author, philanthropist, activist Rachel Cargle on survival optimism, the resilience narrative, and why questioning the stories you tell yourself - with curiosity and kindness - is a powerful path of healing. In this episode we cover: How was grief modeled for you growing up, and how does that affect later grief? Can your memory of childhood grief be…

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51:12

Can We Make This Place Beautiful? with Maggie Smith

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/06/26

How do we live in a world that’s at least half terrible, and that is a conservative estimate?If you recognize that line, you already know Maggie Smith. This week on the show, we’re talking about writing, marriage, divorce, and why you didn’t need whatever happened to you in order to become who you’re meant to be: as Maggie says, “trauma does not give you a “glow up.”” If you’ve ever wanted to write the story of your life - including the messy, difficult parts like divorce, miscarriage, and the

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59:00

Wonder In an Age of Violence: Valarie Kaur & See No...

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/06/19

“Wonder is the root of love, the lack of wonder is the root of violence.” Is there a way to create boundaries with someone who wishes to cause harm? Can you love them and hold them accountable? Do you have to fight for a just world for everyone? Valarie Kaur is no stranger to violence. As a Sikh, as a woman, as a person of color, violence has shaped both her activism and her deep sense of community care. Her Revolutionary Love Project is the blueprint for organizers, activists, and really - anyone

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42:19

The Things That Define Us, with Chase Jarvis: Part Two

It’s OK That You’re Not OK with Megan Devine ·

2023/06/13

If you try to not let something define you, can it define you anyway? You might know Chase Jarvis as an Emmy nominated photographer, founder of Creative Live, and angel investor. The world of venture capital and billion dollar deals isn’t exactly known for its human side, but Chase’s kindness and vulnerability are legendary. In part two of our conversation, we get into a deep discussion over whether a successful person is allowed to feel intense grief, or if success disqualifies you. We unpack

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