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PODCAST

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time

Stories of the materials used in making art are often as thought-provoking and illuminating as the objects themselves. From The Metropolitan Museum of Art, Immaterial examines the materials of art and what they can reveal about history and humanity. Each episode looks at a single material: paper, clay, jade, shells, and others, exploring the qualities and meanings that are often overlooked.

arts visual arts

All Episodes

37:14

Time: Keeping Digital Art Alive

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2024/09/10

How do art conservators save video art from obsolescence? If a painting on canvas rips or a marble sculpture shatters to pieces, art conservators are trained to respond accordingly and repair it. Artworks that unfold over time – like videos and software based works – are a different thing altogether. These artworks are made using cutting-edge technologies that are constantly being updated. If the “canvas” or medium an artwork is made on keeps shifting, how do art conservators protect these works

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41:16

Wood: The Most Musical Tree in the World

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2024/08/27

How did one tree become a world-famous tonewood for guitars? Deep in the forests of Belize, a wood importer from Florida discovered a rare tree that produced a sound unlike anything guitar virtuosos had ever heard before. But why does this material cast such a spell? And at what cost does that come? Guests: Ellen Ruppel Shell, journalist Ken Parker, luthier Reuben Forsland, luthier Steve Cardenas, guitarist Jennifer Anderson, historian and author of Mahogany: The Cost of Luxury in Early America

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34:58

Trash: The Archaeology of Rubbish

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2024/08/13

An archaeologist and an artist walk into a dump… For most of us, we throw our garbage to the curb, and it disappears from our lives. But to some, that’s just the beginning of trash’s story. In this episode, we follow two people who seek the truth in trash—an archaeologist who excavates ancient rubbish in Turkmenistan and an artist who spotlights the people responsible for making trash vanish. Guests: Martina Rugiadi, associate curator, Department of Islamic Art, The Met sTo Len, artist Andy

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44:11

Chia: Beyond Superfoods and Infomercials

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2024/07/30

What can the tiny chia seed reveal about the history of oil painting? For centuries, one of the most prized mediums of art at museums like the Met has been oil painting, a European tradition embodied by the so-called "old masters." This is the story of how the oil of the chia seed — yes, the same one that’s a staple add-on for smoothies and acai bowls — and its origins in Mexico could help us look at oil painting and our world with fresh eyes. Guests: Elsa Arroyo, Mexican paintings conservator

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40:37

Blankets and Quilts: Threads of Identity

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2024/07/16

What happens when our most intimate possessions end up in art museums? Blankets comfort and keep us warm. They accompany us through our lives. They are keepers of some of our most intimate stories. We look at a group of artists who harness this power of blankets and quilts as totems for memory, community and cultural survival. Guests: Loretta Pettway Bennett, Gee's Bend quilt maker Marie Watt, artist Ally Barlow, associate conservator, Department of Textile Conservation, The Met Louisiana P

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38:39

Space, Part 2: Behind the Scenes at The Met

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2024/07/02

What is hidden in the 'empty' spaces of an art museum? The Met is more than a museum of art. It is a city unto itself: population 2,000, with a transient population of 5 million. The Met is 21 buildings nested together like puzzle pieces, and it takes 400,000 light bulbs to illuminate all the spaces. But who actually changes those light bulbs? In this episode, peek behind the curtain and meet the people who maintain the hidden ecosystem of The Met. Guests: Marco Leona, David H. Koch Scientist in

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32:56

Space: Giving Form to a Feeling

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2024/06/18

How does an artist give presence to absence? Bronze, wood, paint, and stone—classic materials for art making. But what if you're trying and struggling to convey a vast expanse, a terrible loss or a haunting presence? In this episode we'll look at two artists who turned to the material of space to express what nothing else could. Guests: Rachel Whiteread, sculptor Brinda Kumar, Associate Curator, Modern and Contemporary Art, The Met Shania Hall, photographer Featured artworks: Rachel Whiteread,

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42:51

Stone: Making and Breaking Legacies

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2024/06/04

What happens when the unbreakable breaks?Throughout art museums around the world, you’ll find ancient stone statues of rulers and marble monuments immortalizing noblemen. These objects were made to survive decay and destruction, to remain intact and whole. But from the moment that stone is extracted from the earth, it is bound to become a more fragmented version of itself–chiseled, chipped, and sometimes shattered over time. In this episode, we examine the many ways that stone breaks. How can a

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2:50

Introducing: Immaterial Season 2

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2024/05/21

What is hiding in the material choices of artists and makers?Immaterial, The Metropolitan Museum of Art’s marquee podcast, is back with eight more episodes that reveal the emotional origins and transformative power of art through the lens of materials. This season we learn from Mexican artisans keeping centuries-old traditions alive; we go to ancient Mesopotamia to understand time travel; and we find a mythical tree in Belize that’s been making music for decades. From traditional materials like

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26:06

Bonus Episode: Tarot

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2022/09/14

Grab a cup of tea and join us for a bonus episode on tarot. We learn about the cards from their patrician origins to the present day, when tarot is being used to subvert limiting tropes of gender and sexuality. A tarot deck begs some questions: what makes something art? And who decides? Some of the answers may surprise you. We meet the artists behind a queer, Southern, collective tarot deck, and hear from an educator at The Met how tarot can be a source of both beauty and resistance. Plus:

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49:28

Metals, Part Two

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2022/08/31

In the second part of our alchemical journey, we meet what ancient philosophers called the “noble” metals: mercury, silver, and gold. How did a nineteenth-century set designer harness one of the most captivating—and toxic—materials in the world and wind up as one of the fathers of photography? When does a coin go from a piece of stamped metal to an act of faith? And how did gold in Ghana go from dust in the water to a touchstone of language, story, and the strength of an

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56:43

Metals, Part One

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2022/08/17

Philosophers and scientists have tried for millennia to crack the code of alchemy: the art of turning lead into gold. But alchemy goes much deeper than that—it gives us a framework for turning metal into story. In the first of a two-part episode on the metals of alchemy, we explore iron, bronze, lead, and copper. Our stories go deep into the basement of The Met, and back in time to a waterlogged ancient tomb. You’ll hear about books that dazzle, puppets that weep, and the long lost sound of

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44:03

Linen

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2022/08/03

Take a spin through The Met and you’ll find thousands of items made from linen. From a 3,500 year old sheet from Ancient Egypt, to a Giorgio Armani suit from the 1980s, linen has been a symbol of wealth and authority. But it's also been a tool for the oppression and exploitation of enslaved people in the American South, and an engine of work and comfort in the Victorian era. Suit up as we undress the legacy of linen through its complex, layered symbolism.Guests: Catharine H. Roehrig,

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40:58

Jade

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2022/07/20

Deep in the riverbeds of Aotearoa New Zealand’s South Island, you’ll find a stone that’s as hard as steel and as green as the first breath of the earth. It’s called pounamu, or nephrite jade. It’s been formed into everything from adzes to earrings, including hei tiki, greenstone pendants handed down in Māori families for generations. Meet a pair of hei tiki—one with two hundred years of family history, and one that's being brought back to life in The Met. From their start as colonial

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39:38

Shells

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2022/07/06

It all begins with a sea creature—a snail called a conch—and the mathematically perfect spiral it transforms into a home, which we humans then put to our lips and play like a trumpet. Throughout time and cultures, conch shells have been used to communicate across great distances, from signaling on the battlefield to connecting with the divine. Hear stories about a jazz musician who plays the conch to connect with his ancestors, why a sacred Incan site way up in the Andes became a ceremonial

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49:28

Clay

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2022/06/22

In seventeenth-century Europe, some of the wealthiest women in the world were doing something strange with the ceramic jars in their curiosity cabinets. They were eating them. But these clay pieces from Mexico—called búcaros—weren't just some bizarre snack. They were seen as a piece of the “New World,” one you could touch, smell, and taste. They were so well known that they even made it into the foreground of masterpiece paintings. But what is the real story behind these jars? Who is

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37:01

Concrete

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2022/06/08

Concrete is full of contradictions. First it’s dust, then liquid, then hard as stone. It’s both rough and smooth, it’s modern and ancient, it can preserve history or play a hand in destroying it. Unsurprisingly, concrete is all about the gray area. Hear about this material from its supporters and detractors alike: why it’s so controversial, why it’s so often used in memorials, and how Colombian artist Doris Salcedo uses it to address grief and mourning. Guests: Nadine M. Orenstein, Drue

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38:31

Paper

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2022/05/25

Valentines, comic books, cigarette cards and more—all of these objects can be meaningful, but what does it mean to house them in a museum? Paper holds our memories, our stories, our fears, and our desires. How do conservators race against time to make them last? Enter the world of handheld ephemera, where keeping these objects in our hands or in our pockets keeps them close to our hearts. Guests: Taz Ahmed, author, activist, and visual artist Rachel Mustalish, conservator, Paper

en

03:53

Introducing: Immaterial

Immaterial: 5,000 Years of Art, One Material at a Time ·

2022/05/08

Introducing Immaterial, a brand new podcast from The Met. Hosted by poet Camille T. Dungy, Immaterial examines the materials of art and what they can reveal about history, humanity, and the world at large. Launching May 25th; new episodes publish every other Wednesday. For a transcript and more information, please visit www.metmuseum.org/immaterial

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