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PODCAST

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About

Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca Toal

Hattie Butterworth and Rebecca Toal host a podcast of insight and change in the classical music and arts professions. Delving into the often stigmatised worlds of mental health, injury, discrimination and productivity, classical music issues are spoken and revived. Join Hattie, Rebecca and guests for important conversations, inspiring moments of wisdom and poignant vulnerability. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

music music interviews

All Episodes

37:50

104. Depression, donors and misogyny: The Break Down

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/11/08

Trigger Warning: suicidal ideation from 13:50 to 18:00Is it ethical that musicians feels 'owned' or controlled by their donors? Today in The Break Down, we are discussing philanthropy in classical music and opera, Hattie's recent experience of depression and the strife of misogyny, sadly still in some of Rebecca's orchestral experiencesWatch this episode on Youtube here.-------------------------------------------------------------Thank you to ABRSM for sponsoring this episode. Explore the drum kit

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57:19

103. The Break Down: Saudi Arabia, Hopelessness &...

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/10/17

Welcome to our rebranded 'chatty episodes' - now, with middling irony and an exaggerated sense of self-awareness, called The Break Down.Hattie brings our Classical Strife newsletter segment to the podcast, we chat about The Met x Saudi Arabia's hot new #collab, we dis/agree on activism, and come to the usual conclusion that mental health is difficult.Like, subscribe, review (if it's nice), and share with both friends and enemies.Watch this episode on Youtube

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57:08

102. Ophelia Gordon: living though anorexia and divorce

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/09/29

Words hold huge power, and for a long time the word 'anorexia' felt dirty to pianist Ophelia Gordon. First experiencing its wrath while studying at the BRIT School and watching her parents' divorce unravel her life, anorexia would return two years ago when Ophelia separated from her husband. She joins Hattie and Rebecca to uncover the story of her eating disorder, the trauma of divorce and the ways in which learning and recording Nikolai Kapustin's music has saved her life.Things Musicians Don't

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1:03:38

101. Jessica Curry: when things fall apart

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/08/14

'If it could have gone wrong it has gone wrong'. The last five years for Jessica Curry, a composer of contemporary classical game music, has been marked by severe illness and personal loss. She joins Hattie and Becca on Things Musicians Don't Talk About to share her journey being diagnosed with ankylosing spondylitis and subsequently shielding during the pandemic. She explains the emotional toll of isolation, the importance of community and support, noting the industry's lack of empathy and her

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51:41

100. We listened to our old episodes… and immediately...

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/07/30

We have reached episode 100 and so decided, as a celebration, we'd take a wee look back... we might now regret it! Listen as we react to the first episode we made together, now over four years ago! Becca also tests Hattie on five years of hot takes – who said what and when?Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by theRoyal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM onInstagram,XandFacebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis

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58:35

99. Lauren McQuistin: eating disorders in classical...

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/07/16

*Trigger warning: discussion of eating disorders, alcoholism, addiction*From our live event at the Royal Society of Musicians on 22nd May 2025Lauren McQuistin has been running the Instagram account @brutalrecovery for years now. Her advocacy for honest recovery discourse has resonated with many alcoholics, particularly with her with her trademark eloquence and dry humour. Lauren now shares her experience of eating disorders - anorexia and bulimia in particular - and how this was especially shaped by

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40:04

98. Performative workaholism, surviving criticism and...

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/07/01

Hattie and Becca discuss the need for many creatives to prove themselves to others online, often sharing data about their work. Do we need a structure and numeric guide for practice or can it be intuitive? And how does this link to intuitive eating? They also go on to discuss the complexities of dealing with criticism, where that sensitivity comes from and how Hattie copes with empathy for performers whilst writing reviews02:51 Workaholics and their quirks16:20 Intuitive eating vs intuitive

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1:05:51

97. Jamie Barton: embodying pride

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/06/18

Mezzo-soprano Jamie Barton has been fighting the corner of the marginalised in classical music now for over 10 years. From a marriage breakdown to a queer awakening and struggles with learning repertoire, Jamie joins Hattie and Becca to discuss her experiences as a queer woman in America and her journey to discovering her ADHD. She also shares powerful insights into body positivity, her approach to music and the importance of using her platform to support marginalised communitiesJamie Barton is at

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34:05

96. Back again, but different

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/06/04

Entering our YouTube era...! And we're talking about returning to things we didn't expect to: Hattie to America and Becca to the harp. We also have a good ol' think about child prodigies, faith and praying, and Becca obsesses further about JULY. We've got some absolutely stellar interviews lined up for release, so stay tuned.Thank you to forScore for advertising with us and to the Royal Society of Musicians for their ongoing support 🙏 forScore: https://forscore.coThings Musicians Don't Talk About

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16:14

95. Meditation for musicians: calming the inner critic

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/05/25

After a performance we term as 'bad', it can be difficult to return to a sense of confidence in our playing. In this fourth mediation, Ruth Philips leads a meditation to disarm the inner critic and restore a sense of peace and acceptance in our performing. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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17:26

94. Meditation for musicians: connecting with your...

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/05/18

Our aim as musicians is to communicate generously and freely to our audience but we rarely turn towards ourselves with the same degree of care. In this meditation, Ruth Philips leads a loving kindness practice, exploring how it might be to extend that kindness outwards towards our audience Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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22:23

93. Meditation for musicians: reconnecting with your...

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/05/10

This meditation aims to bring you closer to your instrument and aid in healing any sense of disconnect you may be feelingDiscover Ruth Philips *Ruth Philips and Lucy Russell are running a course 'Mindfulness for Musicians' at Benslow Music from 13-15 June. More information here*-------------------------------------------------------------Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by theRoyal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM

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19:24

92. Meditation for musicians: pre-performance anxiety

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/05/02

A meditation for musicians lead by cellist and mindfulness meditation teacher Ruth Philips for use to calm the mind around stage fright and performance anxiety. Discover Ruth Philips -------------------------------------------------------------Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by theRoyal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM onInstagram,XandFacebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon

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22:28

91. I wasn’t as good at the cello as I thought I was

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/04/23

'On returning from America, I listened back to lots of my old recordings and discovered a paradox: I had no confidence but also thought I deserved more – thought I was better than I really was'. Hattie sits down to share reflections from her trip to America from health anxiety and Curtis, to self-love and deleting dating apps Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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48:20

90. Lucy Humphris: embracing otherness

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/04/15

This week we interview trumpet player Lucy Humphris about her journey through music college and the contemporary music scene. We speak about the institutional barriers Lucy and others face as a female brass player with a non-traditional career trajectory, sharing her experiences of feeling "othered" and misunderstood. From battling expectations of orchestral conformity to navigating the complex landscape of contemporary music, Lucy reveals the personal and professional struggles of forging her own

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31:31

89. Rigid control, guilt and returning to exercise

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/03/26

Eating disorders and intense practice obsession have a lot in common. How do we move from an 'all or nothing' mindset to something structured and regular? Becca shares the start to her return to exercise following healing from an eating disorder and Hattie shares the parallels to the toxic relationship she has to the cello and hours of practice Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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1:03:48

88. Beyond the 'woman' conversation: Gillian Moore...

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/03/08

There are statements made time and time again when you approach the topic of women in music: 'but historically music by men is just better', 'I'm sick of this wokeism in classical music' and 'people won't buy tickets to concerts of just women's music'. CN Lester and Gillian Moore join us live at the Royal Society of Musicians to unpack these statements and uncover the truth to performance, programming and pessimism around classical women composers.Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by

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1:09:16

87. Emily White on grief, teaching and the joy of...

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/02/21

10 years ago trombonist Emily White lost her husband after a prolonged period of illness. She was thrown into the worlds of death admin and loneliness, but out of it discovered a perspective on what was important as a musician. She shares with Hattie and Becca an insight into her grief journey, as well as her infectious joy of teaching and hatred of the word 'should'. Emily also takes them through her interest in research about practice and performance optimisation and how much joy is able to impact

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1:09:31

86. Book Club: anti-psychiatry and doublings

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/02/05

Is capitalism to blame for the mental health crisis? Should we separate the art from the artist? Rebecca and Hattie have been reading non-fiction. And they are sharing two of the books with each other. Naomi Klein's Doppelganger won the Women's Prize for Non-Fiction in 2024 and has had a strong impact since it hit the bookshelves. The pressure for us to 'perform' online is overwhelming, and Becca brings a musician's perspective to Klein's reflections. Then to what appeared to be anti-psychiatry in

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38:21

85. Mark Brierley on being seen, classical music...

Things Musicians Don"t Talk About ·

2025/01/10

Mark Brierley came to the world of classical music via journalism and without any prior knowledge of the industry. Now, as Head of Membership and Communications at the Royal Society of Musicians, he spends every day hearing from musicians about the reality of their lives. He speaks with Hattie at the RSM headquarters about the origins of the 'Fund for Decay'd Musicians', his perspectives on the industry as an 'outsider' and how he's developed a love for it. They also discuss marketing and

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116 results

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