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PODCAST

On The Merits

Bloomberg Industry Group

On The Merits takes you behind the scenes of the legal world and the inner workings of law firms. This podcast offers in-depth analysis on the latest trends, challenges, and opportunities shaping the business of law and the legal industry overall. You"ll gain insights into how the latest government actions, policies, and business developments are impacting the industry and hear from leading attorneys, legal scholars, industry experts, and our own team of journalists as they share their perspectives

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All Episodes

17:10

Ropes & Gray Is Exception, Not the Rule, for...

On The Merits ·

2025/11/04

Most of the biggest law firms in the US have a two-tier partnership model, where some partners have equity in the firm while others don't. So it was a bit of a surprise when the firm Ropes & Gray announced last month it will be sticking with its one-tier model. Is this a sign that the trend toward non-equity partners is starting to reverse? Not according to today's guests on our podcast, On The Merits, law firm consultant Janet Stanton with Adam Smith Esq. and legal recruiter Scott Love with The

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20:07

Firms That Did Trump Deals Forgot They Were Law...

On The Merits ·

2025/10/28

On this episode of our podcast, On The Merits, we take another look at the reasoning behind the deals law firms struck with the Trump administration earlier this year to avoid punitive executive orders.We previously heard from Yale Law School professor John Morley, who said these firms had no choice because an executive order could have kickstarted a devastating run on the partnership. Today's podcast guest sees it differently. David McGowan, a professor at the University of San Diego School

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14:21

Goodwin Chair on Revenue Rise and New Competitors for...

On The Merits ·

2025/10/21

Goodwin Procter made a splash this month when it announced it had raked in $2.7 billion in the 2025 fiscal year, a record for the firm and a 12% gain from the previous yearOn this episode of our news podcast, On The Merits, we hear from the firm's chair, Anthony McCusker, about how Goodwin managed this feat. He tells Bloomberg Law reporter Tatyana Monnay that he attributes the firm's recent success to a long-term strategic plan it developed called "Goodwin 2033." He also talks about where he

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13:47

What a GC Wants to Hear From His Outside Law Firms on AI

On The Merits ·

2025/10/16

Today's guest on our podcast, On The Merits, is a general counsel who is looking for more from the law firms trying to win his business. Specifically, he wants to hear more about how and why they're using AI.Eric Dodson Greenberg is the top lawyer at Cox Media Group, which owns dozens of TV and radio stations across the country. He recently wrote a series of articles for Bloomberg Law about how generative AI will change the relationship between law firms and their corporate clients—and not

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14:25

Trump Attacks Could Have Killed Law Firms, Yale Prof...

On The Merits ·

2025/10/07

President Donald Trump's attacks on law firms have hand their intended impact, even as courts shoot down executive orders against some as unconstitutional and the details of White House deals with others remain unclear, according to Yale Law School professor John Morley. "The point here is to extract a demonstrative form of obedience," Morely said. He said he's already seen a "chilling effect" with firms less willing to take on matters pushing back against the administration than in Trump's

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12:02

NY's Oldest Law Firm Loses Key Partners, Faces Tough...

On The Merits ·

2025/09/30

You don't get to be the oldest law firm in New York without weathering some rough spots. But this may be one of the most difficult periods Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft has ever gone through. The Wall Street firm, which this week announced a new managing co-partner, has lost nearly three dozen partners just this year. And not all of them have left because of the firm's controversial deal with President Trump for free legal services. On today's episode of our podcast, On The Merits, Bloomberg

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12:28

Every Law Firm Should Build Their Own AI, Yale...

On The Merits ·

2025/09/25

Law firms "have gold sitting on their hard drives," according to Yale Law School professor Scott Shapiro.Shapiro has enthusiastically embraced the use of generative AI in his classroom. He says firms should draw on the mountains of proprietary information at their fingertips to build their own tools. "If only they would train the large language models correctly, they, I believe, would get absolutely stupendous results," he said. Shapiro spoke to Bloomberg Law editor Jessie Kokrda Kamens

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19:13

Data Center Explosion Hands Big Law Cross-Practice...

On The Merits ·

2025/09/23

On today's episode of On The Merits we hear from three lawyers working in the white hot world of data center projects. Mike Rechtin and Justin Stolte are, respectively, real estate and energy partners with Latham & Watkins, and Michelle Kallen is an appellate and advocacy partner at Steptoe."The latest number that I've seen is a $50 billion annual investment in the data center construction area by 2030," Stolte tells Roy Strom. Stolte talks about how his firm has organized to address the

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12:17

Why Law Schools are Making a 'Big Mistake' in AI Era...

On The Merits ·

2025/09/18

The number of law students who graduated in the class of 2024 spiked compared to previous years. That worries Nikia Gray, the head of the National Association for Law Placement."I think it's going to be a big mistake for law schools to continue to admit large law school class sizes," she said, "when we can predict with some pretty good certainty that GenAI is changing the business models of firms and their hiring practices." Gray spoke to Bloomberg Law editor Jessie Kokrda Kamens on our

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14:49

Trump's Law Firm Deals May Have Hurt Headcount: David...

On The Merits ·

2025/09/16

It's still not clear what, if any, fallout the law firms that struck pro bono deals with President Donald Trump earlier this year will face. But analyzing attorney movements over the last six months provides one data point. On average, law firms that settled subsequently lost attorneys more attorneys than those who fought the president in court, according to data obtained by Bloomberg Law columnist David Lat. But there are some firms that buck this overall trend as well as plenty of caveats

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13:43

Wachtell Has Its Fingerprints All Over Delaware Law...

On The Merits ·

2025/09/12

Delaware recently changed its corporate laws to make them more favorable to companies being sued by their shareholders and the mega-firm Wachtell, Lipton, Rosen & Katz was deeply involved in that process.That's raising some eyebrows because Wachtell is also a go-to firm for companies in Delaware, often called the corporate capital of the world. Lawyers from other prominent firms, like Wilson Sonsini and Richards, Layton & Finger, also helped shape the law. On this episode of our podcast, On

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13:09

King & Spalding 2,400 Hour Rule Is Just the Norm,...

On The Merits ·

2025/09/09

A memo from law firm King & Spalding to its associates saying they need to log 2,400 "productive hours" a year surprised some in the legal world. But today's guest on our podcast, On The Merits, says it shouldn't have. It's always been the case that lawyers need to go beyond meeting their billable hours quotas and put in some non-billable hours in order to advance their careers, according to Jessica Chin Somers, a former Big Law attorney and current managing director at Kinney Recruiting. King &

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15:24

Chicago Law Dean on AI: You Won't Be Able to Entirely...

On The Merits ·

2025/09/04

Like most schools worried about academic integrity, the University of Chicago Law School used to discourage its first-year students from using generative AI but now it has crept into that first-year curriculum. Despite its overall inevitability, William Hubbard, a professor and deputy dean, says he's surprised by how often he has to encourage AI-skeptical law students to at least try it out. Hubbard's school has seen how law firms, and especially large law firms, have embraced this new technology

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13:02

What's KPMG Up to With Its New Law Firm in Arizona?

On The Merits ·

2025/09/02

The Big Four accounting firm KPMG has taken advantage of relaxed rules in Arizona to start a law firm there, but the company has broader ambitions outside of the state. KPMG says it doesn't want to compete with established players in the legal industry, but Big Law leaders are privately expressing concerns. That's according to Justin Henry, a Bloomberg Law reporter who's the guest on today's episode of our podcast, On The Merits. Henry talks about the legal work KPMG can do now and about the

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15:34

Big Law United to Save Lucrative White Collar Defense...

On The Merits ·

2025/08/29

The largest law firms in the country are fiercely competitive, so it's notable when nearly 40 of them agree to sign on to a legal brief. That's what happened in an appellate case that could have eroded the attorney-client privilege—and the firms' lucrative white collar defense practices.They breathed a collective sigh of relief earlier this month when the Sixth Circuit overturned a lower court ruling that would have forced FirstEnergy to turn over to its shareholders the results of internal

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14:07

Ex-Skadden Partner Talks Taking on Trump With New...

On The Merits ·

2025/08/26

Benjamin Klubes is a Big Law expat who just founded his own litigation-focused boutique firm—and he's not alone.Other former partners at larger law firms are now either moving to smaller litigation-only firms or, like Klubes, starting their own. In this episode of our podcast, On The Merits, Klubes talks with Bloomberg Law reporter Tatyana Monnay about why he thinks these boutique firms are better suited to taking on the Trump administration than firms like Skadden, where he was a partner in the

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11:27

Law Firms Look Like Enticing Targets for Outside...

On The Merits ·

2025/08/21

If it wasn't already clear, it is now: well-capitalized investors want a piece of the US legal industry.The latest example of this trend came this week when the litigation funder Burford Capital announced that now, in addition to financing individual lawsuits, it also wants to buy minority stakes in entire law firms. This comes after the consulting giant KPMG won a license earlier this year to start its own legal practice in Arizona after the state loosened its rules on who can own firms. On

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13:10

Why Do More Big Law Lawyers Want Off the Partner Track?

On The Merits ·

2025/08/19

The allure of making partner doesn't hold the same appeal that it used to for many Big Law associates. Some of them are swallowing a pay cut to jump to a smaller firm.That's according to Major, Lindsey & Africa partner and recruiter Kate Reder Sheikh, who wrote about the trend for Bloomberg Law. She spoke to Bloomberg Law editor Jessie Kokrda Kamens for our podcast, On The Merits, about why some associates are forgoing the riches of partnership and exit the Big Law universe. "The pay is going

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12:46

When a Law Firm's Tech Venture Goes South, the...

On The Merits ·

2025/08/15

The law firm Norton Rose Fullbright thought it was taking a great leap forward when it brought on two partners and acquired the legal tech startup they co-founded, NMBL Technologies. Now, the firm and the startup are mired in a messy litigation battle against one another.On this episode of our podcast, On The Merits, Bloomberg Law reporters Alex Ebert and Evan Ochsner get into the unusual agreement these two parties made with each other and why it ended so poorly. They also talk about the myriad

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14:31

Did Associates Who Quit Over Trump Deals Burn Big Law...

On The Merits ·

2025/08/12

A wave of associate lawyers resigned in protest from their Big Law jobs earlier this year after their firms struck controversial pro bono deals with the Trump administration. Do they have any regrets? According to Bloomberg Law reporters Justin Henry and Elleiana Green, not really. They spoke with several former associates who say they stand by their decisions to, as one legal recruiter put it, "loudly quit." But that doesn't mean the road ahead will be easy. On this episode of our podcast, On

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