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PODCAST

Debunking Economics - the podcast

Steve Keen & Phil Dobbie

Economist Steve Keen talks to Phil Dobbie about the failings of the neoclassical economics and how it reflects on society. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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All Episodes

45:10

Wages, jobs and inflation

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/11/12

This week Phil and Steve look at cost-plus inflation, driven by rising wages. Right now its being given as the reason that services inflation is remaining sticky and that’s why many central banks are reluctant to reduce interest rates. Steve says it’s a far more sensible assumption than the neoclassical belief, promulgated by Milton Friedman, that inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon.It's not just workers who can put prices up, of course. Companies can increase their margins, and

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47:18

Narrow economies vs broad economies

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/11/06

Is it fair enough to totally write off Ricardo’s theory of competitive advantage? Certainly, President Trump isn’t an advocate, using tariffs to protect America’s domestic industries from those countries that produce stuff cheaper. A broad economy, producing a range of products and services, is preferably to a narrow one, reliant on one or two key exports, which is what Ricardo advocated. But in support of Ricardo, some of the narrowest economies, like Australia, have some of the highest levels of

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46:04

Reeves has all the wrong ideas

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/10/29

The UK Labour party has struggled to forge a recovery for the beleaguered economy. Rachel Reeves is intent on reducing the government deficit. Her first attempt involved increasing the National Insurance contributions made by businesses – in effect, raising a payrolls tax. In short, a reason for companies unsure about recruiting in a slow growth economy to err on the side of caution. Now, there’s talk of tax rises.Steve and phil talk about the impact on growth of added more to the consumer’s tax

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39:30

Chancellor Churchill fighting job creation

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/10/22

Before he was the UK Prime Minister at war with the Nazis, Winston Churchill ws the UK’s Chancellor. He played it very straight, with a preoccupation with balancing the budget. He also took the Uk back onto the Gold Exchange, despite warnings from Keynes that the move would be deflationary. In 1928 he reinforced his neoclassical credentials, saying very little additional employment and no permanent employment can be created by state borrowing and state expenditure. That is, of course, the exact

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43:19

The Ins and Outs of Foreign Money

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/10/15

In UK politicians of all persuasions agree that foreign investment I s important to add to the growth of the UK economy. Steve says you have to have foreigners buying into the UK to counter the currency losses from a sizeable balance of trade deficit. But a lot of that investment will see profits being repatriated back overseas. And then there’d the overseas investment in UK bonds and shares. Andy Burnham, the Manchester Mayor who seems to be positioning himself to replace Keir Starmer, has said we

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48:56

Corbyn’s New Party Needs New Economic Thinking

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/10/08

recent spoke at a meeting of Jeremy Corbyn’s new venture – Your Party. Steve gave a presentation on how governments can spend more without worrying about the deficit, provided it was done sensibly. The argument that the private sector buying up government bonds will crowd out investment in other initiatives is bunkum. The private sector can still borrow for investment, perhaps benefiting from the enhanced infrastructure and trading environment government spending has created. But Phil argues there’s

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44:05

QE, QT and the control of central banks

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/10/01

During the pandemic central banks had no choice but to buy up government bonds. There were just so many of them being issued. That’s why the UK’s quantitative easing program totalled more than £900 billion during 2020-1. Recently, the bank – like other central banks the world over – are trying to unwind these huge additions to their balance sheet. Recently the Bank of England slowed down the pace at which they sold-off these assets. Why? In part because this process of ‘quantitative tightening’ can

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41:05

Does a government deficit help the rich?

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/09/23

You would assume that government spending is largely designed to help those on lower incomes. The NHS was designed to ensure free healthcare for all. The same for public education. And for welfare payments. So, I theory, the more the government spends, the more wealth is transferred to lower incomes.This week Phil and Steve explore the idea that rising government deficits actually help the rich.That’s because the so-called debt is financed by the issuance of bonds, much of which is nought on the

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42:26

Will Europe every get its mojo back?

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/09/17

After the war the European economy was humming along, with growth rates of 5 percent or more.Now Germany’s forecast to grow by just 0.1 percent. Allowing for population growth and inflation and it’s an economy in decline. Steve says part of the problem is the assumption that rising government debt is bad for the economy – the old neoclassical belief that if the government spends, it crowds out the private sector. They’ve been testing that theory in Europe for a while now, and it isn’t working for

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46:36

is it RIP for IP?

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/09/10

Copyright and IP rights has always been notoriously difficult to protect. Does it become impossible with the rise of AI? The ideas presented to you through your favourite AI engine come from somewhere whose ideas are being used to support an argument. Or, if you create an artwork that is analysed and used to create other artworks, has copyright been infringed, or is what we would have traditionally called inspiration? Phil asks, is it time to just admit defeat and accept that copyright is an

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45:00

Will AI deliver – and at what cost?

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/09/03

We keep hearing about the productivity gains from AI. This week Phil asks Steve about the difference between productivity for a company versus the societal benefits.For example, AI and robots might do a job more efficiently than a human, but it’ll chew up energy in the process, and the human will still be consuming energy as well, unless robots start killing us off. So, this revolution might make some companies more efficient, but as a society as a whole what is the price we are paying? Or is Phil

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42:00

UBI and the tech bros

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/08/27

The small number of technologists who increasingly control the planet’s wealth and political and social agenda are, it seems, big supporters of UBI. Elon Musk is at the forefront of this push.And why wouldn’t he be? His vision is a future of unbounding economic growth, in which the work of humans is almost completely replaced by robots, leaving us all plenty of time to pursue interests, engage in deep philosophical thought or, more likely, get fat watching daytime TV with no sense of purpose. This

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41:55

Countering the Cantillon Effect

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/08/20

18th century economist Richard Cantillon theorised that new money added to the economy always reaches the wealthiest people first.If there’s a lot of it, the extra supply will push up prices, but the rich won’t feel it, they’ll just create it. The impact down the track is that the poor, surviving with the same money as before, get hit with the higher prices.Phil suggests that wouldn’t be the case if extra money was created through government spending. It would be the workers and those on welfare

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45:30

Planning, egos and resources

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/08/13

Phil and Steve pick up from last week’s discussion about the merits of central planning. Last time they talked about how big companies, like Walmart in the US, plan centrally, yet free marketeers have a problem with that sort of coordination being applied to the free market. This week Phil asks how you can ensure that government planning can ensure resources are allocated effectively. For example, isn’t there a risk that you’ll use raw materials and labour to satisfy the wants of the very rich,

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39:37

The need for central planning

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/08/06

In one of his many walks around his neighbourhood Phil has been listening to a book, The People's Republic of Walmart, by Leigh Phillips & Michal Rozworski. Basically, a contrarian economist and a journalist teaming up together. Could such a combination ever really work?The book highlights how part of Walmart’s success story was its meticulous central planning, in contrast to Sears, a business decimated by an adherence to a market based internal structure. 30 internal division competed for

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36:01

Lessons from Lesotho on trade and alliances

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/07/30

Lesotho (pronounced ,li-su-tu0 is a small African nature that President Trumpthreatened with 50% tariffs, describing as a country nobody had ever heard of.Maybe that’s enough for his disciples to dismiss the hardship tariffs will place on the country, where youth unemployment is rife and the minimum wage is US$100 per month. Phil says twenty years ago America was trying to help countries like Lesotho, with tariff free trade to help the economy grow.Why? Because as Steve points out, if developing

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41:27

Getting the numbers we need

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/07/23

There is a huge reliance on data to aid decision making – whether it’s Investors wanting to know where to move money, central banks pretending to understand the economy, governments making policy decisions or companies planning for their future.Sadly, data collection faces two challenges. One is a lack of sufficient government spending.As Steve points out, perhaps Texas would be more prepared for the horrendous flooding of the last few weeks, if they hadn’t sacked so many meteorologists. The other

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39:54

The self-induced healthcare trap

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/07/16

In real terms the amount the UK spends on healthcare has risen from £500 in 1970 to £3,000 per person today. That’s a massive increase, but the payback has been that we are living 10 years longer. Ask people if they would be prepared to spend 10% of their income to live ten years longer, most would say yes. Yet we have a real problem in having the government spending more on healthcare.As always, it gets back to the question of where is the money coming from? A government provided healthcare system

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44:14

Blowing the budget?

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/07/09

Financial markets don’t like it when governments announce plans to spend more money. That’s why there’s concern over Donald Trump’s Big Beautiful Bill, which will add, by some accounts, $4 trillion to the US budget deficit over the next decade. Steve Keen says it’s not a problem. Banks buy up the bonds and the central bank ensures they have the liquidity to do so.In which case, why are people ditching US bonds in favour of other sovereign debt elsewhere? And isn’t there a risk that higher treasury

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41:56

Ditching the dollar

Debunking Economics - the podcast ·

2025/07/02

There’s been a lot of talk lately about de-dollarisation. In other words, global investors are parking less of their money in US dollars (in the form of US treasuries/bonds). What was once considered a safe choice, is now seen as having more risk, and that’s being accentuated right now by the falling value of the US dollar. If, as an overseas investor, you bought US government bonds a t the start of the year, they’d be worth 10 percent less now, simply because that’s how much the dollar has fallen

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