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PODCAST

Just Say No To The DSO

Dentistry is experiencing an attack by well-funded corporations who want to own the work of each dentist’s hands. While the promises of wealth and ease DSO’s present to owner-dentists appear enticing, experience shows the reality is very different. Just Say No to the DSO is a deep dive podcast for dentists in all stages of their career. It is especially for those who are looking at whether or not the option to sell to a DSO is the right choice. Our expert hosts, Bob Spiel, MBA and Nate Williams,

health & fitness medicine

All Episodes

25:55

Too Big to Sell: Myth vs Reality

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/11/15

The conversation explores the myth surrounding the belief that dental practices are too large to sell to private buyers. It delves into the origins of this misconception and its impact on the dental community, emphasizing that size should not deter practice owners from considering private buyers.

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73:27

Practice Transition Advice with Dan and Aaron Lewis

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/10/30

In this conversation, Nate speaks with Dan and Aaron Lewis about the complexities of dental practice transitions, particularly focusing on the implications of selling to Dental Service Organizations (DSOs). They discuss the emotional aspects of practice transitions, the financial realities of selling to DSOs versus maintaining private practice, and the importance of relationships in the dental industry. The Lewis family emphasizes the need for education and awareness among dentists regarding their

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28:01

A Very Important Math Lesson

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/10/17

Bob and Nate are back to discuss the common misconception that DSOs pay more for dental practices than private buyers and they are bringing receipts. They delve into the concept of EBITDA, explaining its significance in practice valuation and how it impacts the financial outcomes for practice owners. Through a hypothetical example, they illustrate the true costs associated with selling to a DSO, revealing that many dentists may end up paying more than they realize. The conversation emphasizes the

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21:54

Season 4 Episode 6 - Listener Question: Practice...

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/09/07

In this episode of 'Just Say No to the DSO', hosts Bob and Nate discuss the complexities of transitioning dental practices, particularly for those with multiple locations. They address listener questions about ownership options, financing, and the importance of goodwill in practice valuation. The conversation emphasizes the need for clear pathways to ownership and the potential pitfalls of seller financing, while also exploring strategies for divesting practices effectively.

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22:22

Season 4 Episode 5 - The Art of Transitioning Your...

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/08/25

Bob and Nate discuss the complexities of transitioning a dental practice without selling to a DSO. They explore the concept of a walk away sale, addressing common uncertainties and fears among practice owners. The conversation also debunks prevalent myths about the dental market, particularly regarding younger dentists' willingness to own practices and the availability of financing for buyers. The hosts emphasize the importance of hiring qualified brokers and being realistic about expectations

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34:23

Season 4 Episode 4 - Embracing Uncertainty: The...

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/08/16

In this conversation, Bob and Nate discuss the complexities of transitioning a dental practice, particularly focusing on the implications of selling to a DSO versus bringing on an associate. They explore the emotional and financial uncertainties that dentists face when considering their exit strategies, emphasizing the importance of planning and understanding the realities of practice management. The discussion highlights the pros and cons of various transition options, including the challenges of

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53:36

Special Episode - You Are The Brand with Steven J...

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/08/08

In this conversation, Bob Spiel and Steven J Anderson delve into the evolving landscape of dentistry, particularly focusing on the impact of Dental Service Organizations (DSOs) on the profession. They discuss the importance of grounding oneself in key principles before making decisions, the necessity of understanding one's market, and the significance of mastering patient interactions. The conversation emphasizes the need for dentists to surround themselves with the right people, continually improve

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23:36

Season 4 Episode 3 - The Risks of Selling Your Practice

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/08/02

In this episode, Bob and Nate discuss the evolving landscape of dental service organizations (DSOs) and the implications for private practice owners. They explore the risks associated with selling to DSOs, the changing nature of DSO offers, and the importance of retaining control over one's practice. The conversation highlights the historical context of DSO contracts, the value of dentists in practice ownership, and the potential pitfalls of partnering with DSOs.

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28:52

Season 4 Episode 2 - The DSO Dilemma: A Cautionary Tale

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/07/21

Bob and Nate continue discussing the implications of selling dental practices to Dental Service Organizations (DSOs). They argue that selling to a DSO can lead to financial loss and loss of control for dentists. The conversation highlights the hype surrounding DSOs, the influence of celebrity endorsements, and the pressure tactics used to encourage practice sales. The hosts emphasize the importance of maintaining ownership and the potential pitfalls of selling practices, urging dentists to consider

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29:43

Season 4 Episode 1 - Navigating the Dental Landscape:...

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/07/16

In this episode of 'Just Say No to the DSO', hosts Bob Spiel and Nate Williams discuss the implications of the DSO movement in dentistry. They emphasize the importance of private practice ownership, the challenges faced by dental practice owners, and the impact of insurance and government intervention on the industry. The conversation highlights the benefits of maintaining control over one's practice and the potential pitfalls of selling to a DSO.

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92:13

Season 3 Episode 16 - Away Interview With Gary Bird

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/06/30

Nate ventures out into the wilderness and is guest with Gary Bird for today's episode. This is a collabortive project and highlights the great being done to further the conversation around dentistry and it's future. For those not familiar, Gary Bird is the founding owner of SMC National, the dental industry’s top-rated marketing partner chosen by more than 60,000 dental professionals. A recognized thought leader, Gary hosts the popular shows Dental Marketing Theory and Dental Marketing Goat, where

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43:22

Season 3 Episode 15 - Dr Lou Berman Interview

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/06/20

In this inspiring conversation, Bob and Dr. Lou Berman delve into the complexities of the DSO landscape, particularly within the field of endodontics. They discuss the financial implications of joining a DSO, the role of key opinion leaders in shaping the industry, and the impact of corporate models on patient care. Dr. Berman shares his insights from over 41 years in the field, emphasizing the importance of maintaining control over one's practice and the need for dental professionals to seek expert

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41:14

Season 3 Episode 14 - Dr Mila and Daniel Cohen Interview

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/06/16

In this conversation, Bob hosts Daniel and Mila Cohen, who share their journey of building a successful independent dental practice. They discuss the challenges and rewards of partnership, the importance of defining roles, and the strategies they implemented to ensure effective management and accountability within their practice. The conversation highlights the significance of communication, utilizing resources, and the need for clarity in leadership to foster a thriving business environment. In

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36:04

Season 3 Episode 13 - Dr Jill Tanzi and Dr Kristine...

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/05/26

We are in for a double treat today as Bob interviews two incredible dentists, Dr Jill Tanzi and Dr Kristine Grazioso. Not only are we staying on the east coast for this episode, both of these amazing practitioners are passionate about dentistry and helping the patient get the best care. They are board and founding members of the Alliance for Independent Dentists, a nationwide group of volunteer dentists committed to educating dentists and the public about the benefits of Independent Dentistry. None

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25:28

Season 3 Episode 12 - Dr Eric Block Interview

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/05/14

Bob is back and rolling with another great guest. We are headed to the east coast, just outside of Boston with Dr Eric Block. Dr. Block is a member of the American Dental Association, the Massachusetts Dental Society, and the American Academy of Cosmetic Dentistry and is a Fellow of the International Congress of Oral Implantologists. These type of credentials make him a perfect candidate to be courted by several major DSOs who are looking to add a talented dentist to their roster. However, Eric

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53:31

Season 3 Episode 11 - Dr. Robert M McNamara Interview

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/04/21

The hits continue at Just Say No, Bob interviews esteemed MD Dr. Robert McNamara who is a professor and Chair of Emergency Medicine at the Lewis Katz School of Medicine at Temple University to go over the eerie similarities between the corporate involvement in emergency medicine and dental practices. The similarities are not just skin deep.

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47:55

Season 3 Episode 10 - Jason Wood is Back Part 2

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/04/06

Super star guest Jason Wood hops back in the ring with Nate in order to clean up some lingering questions and try to address some long standing fallicies from a previous, high profile interview. He brings the info with receipts every time he visit's the DSO show.

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45:04

Season 3 Episode 10 - Jason Wood is Back Part 1

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/04/06

Super star guest Jason Wood hops back in the ring with Nate in order to clean up some lingering questions and try to address some long standing fallicies from a previous, high profile interview. He brings the info with receipts every time he visit's the DSO show.

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55:40

Season 3 Episode 9 - Dr Aaron Swapp from Swapp...

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/03/17

Here is part 2 of our great interview with Dr. Aaron Swapp. The conversation gets very dialed in between Nate and Dr Swapp.

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52:42

Season 3 Episode 8 - Dr Aaron Swapp from Swapp...

Just Say No To The DSO ·

2025/03/17

Nate is back traveling around the country in order to get the best interviews with the best professionals. We were put in touch with Dr Aaron Swap in order to have a great discussion on if...with a big if...DSOs are ever worth it? As well, how do things apply to orthodontics and what is really needed to run an amazing practice? Tune in for another great episode.

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