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PODCAST

Messy Social Work

Messy Social Work

Welcome to the Messy Social Work podcast. The hosts are Richard Devine and Tim Fisher.Check out our website here: https://www.relationalactivism.com/

science social sciences

All Episodes

76:54

Rich and Tim speak to Janet Kay OBE about her...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/04/02

Janet Kay is a prominent kinship carer, trustee for the charity Kinship, and OBE recipient who advocates for families in England raising relatives' children. Based in Sheffield, she has cared for her grandson since he was 18 months old, advocating for better financial and practical support, and overcoming the "dump and run" lack of resources for caregivers. Key Aspects of Janet Kay's Work and Experience: Advocacy: She serves on the Independent Review of Children's Social Care's Expert...

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75:19

Rich and Tim speak to Professor Jonathan Scourfield...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/03/27

Professor Jonathan Scourfield is a leading UK academic in social work, currently based at Cardiff University. His work spans child welfare, social care inequalities, suicide and self‑harm research, and working with men across the life course This one https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=6079816tests if participation quality (i.e., how well families said their voice was heard) was linked to outcomes and finds that yes it was, though not for all outcomes we measured. ...

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56:22

Rich and Tim speak to Juliette Davies about...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/03/21

A few years ago, Rich carried out an assessment that concluded Juliette couldn’t safely care for her children. It was a difficult moment, shaped by years of substance misuse, trauma, and repeated involvement from services. That assessment recommended residential rehabilitation. Juliette went on to take that step. In this conversation, Rich and Tim speak with Juliette about what was happening in her life at the time, why previous support hadn’t led to lasting change, and what was different abo...

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75:21

Rich and Tim on practice lessons from the tragic...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/03/13

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/ Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

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65:34

Rich and Tim speak to Ethan St Pierre about trauma...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/03/06

Connect with Ethan here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ethan-st-pierre-bb58403ab/ Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/ Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

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65:36

Rich and Tim speak to Ethan St Pierre about growing...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/02/27

Connect with Ethan here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ethan-st-pierre-bb58403ab/ Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/ Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

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62:42

Rich and Tim talk to Mark Hopfenbeck about the...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/02/20

In this conversation, Rich and Tim and Mark Hopfenbeck explore the concept of Open Dialogue, its origins, and its application in mental health and social work. They discuss the importance of community involvement, the need for continuity in care, and the training required to develop relational skills. Mark emphasizes the significance of peer support and the challenges faced in implementing Open Dialogue in various settings. The conversation also touches on the role of evidence in validating O...

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33:10

Connecting Research: Why young people don't access...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/02/11

In this episode, we speak with Dr Mina Fazel, a British psychiatrist who is Professor and Chair of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry in the Department of Psychiatry at the University of Oxford. Her research considers the mental health of children and young people, and how to design effective mental health interventions. We talk to her about a recent paper: Adolescent consent and Generation Alpha: bridging policy, practice and empirical evidence in healthcare, you can download it here: h...

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52:31

BONUS Episode: Rich and Tim reflect on what its like...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/01/30

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/ Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

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47:22

Rich and Tim talk to Seana McDermott (Social Worker...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/01/30

This week, we speak to Seana, a social worker in a Child in Care Team. We explore what her role involves, how she builds relationships with young people, carers, and families, and the challenges she faces—as well as what helps her keep going. We’re really grateful to Seana for taking the time to talk with us, especially given how busy the role is. We hope you enjoy her passion, child‑centred practice, and commitment to the work as much as we did. Relational Activism: https://www.r...

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51:21

Rich and Tim hear about Handstands, Breakdance...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/01/23

In this two-part episode of Messy Social Work, hosts Richard Devine and Tim Fisher speak with Dr Anna Harvey about the realities of child protection practice, reflective supervision, and the emotional weight of decision-making. Using a selection of Anna’s vivid LinkedIn posts and readings as a jumping-off point, the conversation moves from psychoanalytic ideas like organisational mindlessness, fear, guilt, and compassion, into leadership and workplace culture, challenging the “hero narrative”...

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59:36

Rich and Tim speak to Dr Anna Harvey about fear...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/01/16

In this two-part episode of Messy Social Work, hosts Richard Devine and Tim Fisher speak with Dr Anna Harvey about the realities of child protection practice, reflective supervision, and the emotional weight of decision-making. Using a selection of Anna’s vivid LinkedIn posts and readings as a jumping-off point, the conversation moves from psychoanalytic ideas like organisational mindlessness, fear, guilt, and compassion, into leadership and workplace culture, challenging the “hero narrative”...

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45:40

Rich and Tim return to talk boundaries, creating...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/01/09

Rich and Tim are back in the studio of the Messy Social Work Podcast, shaking off the holiday cobwebs and diving straight into the age-old tradition of New Year’s resolutions. Tim’s on a mission to set some firm boundaries, while Rich is dreaming of carving out a little breathing space—because who doesn’t need that in social work? But that’s not all. We’ve got our roving news correspondent and Community Care editor, Mithran Samuels, joining us to give the lowdown on what’s changing across chi...

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74:26

Rich and Tim wrap up the year in conversation with...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/12/19

Rich and Tim are joined by Andrew Turnell to reflect on 2025. Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/ Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

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67:48

Rich and Tim speak to Prof Donald Forrester about...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/12/12

In this episode of The Messy Social Work Podcast, we sit down with Professor Donald Forrester, researcher and social worker. We talk about why he thinks social workers are a bit like Nanny McPhee, why social work isn’t really about “helping,” and why conflict sits at the heart of the work we do. Donald shares the stories behind some of his most memorable anecdotes—from the baseball bat incident to the £20 haircut—and what they taught him about dignity, power, and human connection....

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51:31

Rich and Tim speak to Charlotte Clark (Child...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/12/05

Rich and Tim sit down with Charlotte Clark, a practising frontline child protection social worker, to explore what it means to build trust in contexts where distrust runs deep. From navigating statutory power dynamics to managing conflict under intense pressure, Charlotte shares insights from her early career journey, reporting from the frontline and reflects on the relational skills that matter most. Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection...

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42:30

Rich and Tim speak with Anam Raja to discuss the...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/11/28

Full research and report found here https://kinship.org.uk/our-work-and-impact/research/raised-by-relatives/

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48:17

Rich and Tim ask each other surprising & difficult...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/11/21

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/ Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/ Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/

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52:10

Rich and Tim discuss the Trauma Industrial Complex

Messy Social Work ·

2025/11/14

This week on Messy Social Work, Rich and Tim take a deep dive into Darren McGarvey’s The Trauma Industrial Complex — a book that pulls no punches about how society packages, sells, and performs trauma. We explore McGarvey’s core argument that trauma has become a kind of cultural currency, often stripped of nuance and turned into content. We talk about the emotional labour placed on lived-experience workers, the myths of the “hero’s journey,” and the three layers of victimhood: victimhoo...

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44:50

Connecting Research: linking childhood maltreatment...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/11/11

In this Connecting Research episode, we speak to a lecturer and researcher at University College London, Dr Patrizia Pezzoli, about an article she co-authored, titled: Lived-experience perspectives on the psychological factors linking childhood maltreatment to later intimate partner violence victimization. See paper here Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-p...

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99 results

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