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PODCAST

Messy Social Work

Messy Social Work

Welcome to the Messy Social Work podcast. The hosts are Richard Devine and Tim Fisher.Check out our website here: https://www.relationalactivism.com/

science social sciences

All Episodes

52:31

BONUS Episode: Rich and Tim reflect on what its like...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/01/30

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/ Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

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47:22

Rich and Tim talk to Seana McDermott (Social Worker...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/01/30

This week, we speak to Seana, a social worker in a Child in Care Team. We explore what her role involves, how she builds relationships with young people, carers, and families, and the challenges she faces—as well as what helps her keep going. We’re really grateful to Seana for taking the time to talk with us, especially given how busy the role is. We hope you enjoy her passion, child‑centred practice, and commitment to the work as much as we did. Relational Activism: https://www.r...

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51:21

Rich and Tim hear about Handstands, Breakdance...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/01/23

In this two-part episode of Messy Social Work, hosts Richard Devine and Tim Fisher speak with Dr Anna Harvey about the realities of child protection practice, reflective supervision, and the emotional weight of decision-making. Using a selection of Anna’s vivid LinkedIn posts and readings as a jumping-off point, the conversation moves from psychoanalytic ideas like organisational mindlessness, fear, guilt, and compassion, into leadership and workplace culture, challenging the “hero narrative”...

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59:36

Rich and Tim speak to Dr Anna Harvey about fear...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/01/16

In this two-part episode of Messy Social Work, hosts Richard Devine and Tim Fisher speak with Dr Anna Harvey about the realities of child protection practice, reflective supervision, and the emotional weight of decision-making. Using a selection of Anna’s vivid LinkedIn posts and readings as a jumping-off point, the conversation moves from psychoanalytic ideas like organisational mindlessness, fear, guilt, and compassion, into leadership and workplace culture, challenging the “hero narrative”...

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45:40

Rich and Tim return to talk boundaries, creating...

Messy Social Work ·

2026/01/09

Rich and Tim are back in the studio of the Messy Social Work Podcast, shaking off the holiday cobwebs and diving straight into the age-old tradition of New Year’s resolutions. Tim’s on a mission to set some firm boundaries, while Rich is dreaming of carving out a little breathing space—because who doesn’t need that in social work? But that’s not all. We’ve got our roving news correspondent and Community Care editor, Mithran Samuels, joining us to give the lowdown on what’s changing across chi...

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74:26

Rich and Tim wrap up the year in conversation with...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/12/19

Rich and Tim are joined by Andrew Turnell to reflect on 2025. Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/ Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/

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67:48

Rich and Tim speak to Prof Donald Forrester about...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/12/12

In this episode of The Messy Social Work Podcast, we sit down with Professor Donald Forrester, researcher and social worker. We talk about why he thinks social workers are a bit like Nanny McPhee, why social work isn’t really about “helping,” and why conflict sits at the heart of the work we do. Donald shares the stories behind some of his most memorable anecdotes—from the baseball bat incident to the £20 haircut—and what they taught him about dignity, power, and human connection....

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51:31

Rich and Tim speak to Charlotte Clark (Child...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/12/05

Rich and Tim sit down with Charlotte Clark, a practising frontline child protection social worker, to explore what it means to build trust in contexts where distrust runs deep. From navigating statutory power dynamics to managing conflict under intense pressure, Charlotte shares insights from her early career journey, reporting from the frontline and reflects on the relational skills that matter most. Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection...

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42:30

Rich and Tim speak with Anam Raja to discuss the...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/11/28

Full research and report found here https://kinship.org.uk/our-work-and-impact/research/raised-by-relatives/

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48:17

Rich and Tim ask each other surprising & difficult...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/11/21

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/ Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/ Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/

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52:10

Rich and Tim discuss the Trauma Industrial Complex

Messy Social Work ·

2025/11/14

This week on Messy Social Work, Rich and Tim take a deep dive into Darren McGarvey’s The Trauma Industrial Complex — a book that pulls no punches about how society packages, sells, and performs trauma. We explore McGarvey’s core argument that trauma has become a kind of cultural currency, often stripped of nuance and turned into content. We talk about the emotional labour placed on lived-experience workers, the myths of the “hero’s journey,” and the three layers of victimhood: victimhoo...

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44:50

Connecting Research: linking childhood maltreatment...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/11/11

In this Connecting Research episode, we speak to a lecturer and researcher at University College London, Dr Patrizia Pezzoli, about an article she co-authored, titled: Lived-experience perspectives on the psychological factors linking childhood maltreatment to later intimate partner violence victimization. See paper here Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-p...

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46:55

Rich and Tim speak to Toni Mayo about Radical Social...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/11/07

In this episode, we have a returning guest: social worker and team manager Toni Mayo. Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme Rich Devine's blog: https://richarddevinesocialwork.com/about/ Tim Fisher LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/timfisher101/ Rich Devine LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-devine-181763177/

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63:55

Rich and Tim speak to Rhian Taylor on the tension...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/10/31

In this episode, we explore the tension between the fast-paced, task-driven nature of social work and the deeper need for presence, reflection, and meaning. Rhian Taylor shares insights from her recent blog on why it’s so hard for practitioners to stop—and how doing so can radically improve our wellbeing and the quality of our practice. We talk about: The systemic pressures that reward constant “doing”The emotional and professional cost of never stoppingHow rest, reflection, and inner a...

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66:00

Rich and Tim speak to Nicki Pettitt, Consultant...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/10/25

Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Context Counts: Improving the analysis of socio-economic context and intersectionality in Local Child Safeguarding Practice Reviews: https://www.techne.ac.uk/research-and-education/departments-and-schools/law-and-criminology/research/our-projects-and-research-impact/context-counts-improving-the-analysis-of-socio-economic-context-and-intersectionality-in-local-child-safeguarding-practice-reviews/ Rich's BASW Child Protect...

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44:11

Rich and Tim probe Community Care Editor, Mithran for...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/10/17

Josh MacAlister has said he’d like children to have a choice of where and with whom they live: https://www.communitycare.co.uk/2025/10/02/children-in-care-should-have-choice-of-where-and-with-whom-they-live-says-macalister/ Applications to register children’s homes are rocketing, such that Ofsted is having to prioritise applications, leaving others having to wait up to 18 months. https://www.communitycare.co.uk/2025/10/13/some-childrens-homes-face-waits-of-up-to-18-months-to-register-un...

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64:01

Rich and Tim speak to Dr Paul Shuttleworth on what...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/10/09

In this episode of the Messy Social Work Podcast, Rich and Tim speak with Dr Paul Shuttleworth about his new book Listening to Children about Kinship Care: Child Welfare and Permanence. Drawing on powerful research and direct testimony from children and young people, Paul shares what they say really matters when professionals make decisions about kinship care, permanence, and support. We explore: Why listening to children is essential in kinship care planningThe emotional and relational compl...

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79:18

Rich and Tim speak to Dr Lorna Stabler about lived...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/10/03

In this episode, we explore why lived experience has become such a dominant force in social work, and ask: what are we missing when we treat it as unquestionable truth? Dr Stabler helps us think critically about how stories are used, who gets to tell them, and what happens when experience becomes currency. This is a conversation about ethics, representation, and the uncomfortable edges of practice. Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Prote...

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48:59

Rich and Tim reflect on their personal failures,...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/09/26

In this episode, Rich and Tim: How to Succeed at Failing, we reflect on the times we’ve got it wrong — professionally and personally — and explore why failure isn’t just inevitable, but essential. From missteps to lessons learned, we talk about how embracing failure can lead to growth, insight, and even unexpected success. Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-p...

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75:05

Rich and Tim interview Prof Rick Barth on the top...

Messy Social Work ·

2025/09/19

In this thoughtful and research-informed conversation, Rich and Tim speak with Professor Rick Barth about his influential article, “Ten Common Child Welfare Misconceptions.” The episode explores how widely held beliefs about child protection and foster care often diverge from evidence and practice realities. Relational Activism: https://www.relationalactivism.com/ Rich's BASW Child Protection sessions: https://basw.co.uk/social-work-child-protection-professional-practice-programme Rich De...

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91 results

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