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PODCAST

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom

From Tenacious Change, featuring Tom Klaus and Lamar Roth

"Third Space" is a space where two or more people with differing viewpoints, ideologies, and worldviews can come together to hear, listen, share, and connect with one another. In this podcast two lifelong friends, Lamar Roth & Tom Klaus, carve out a Third Space where everything can be on the table for open, straightforward, honest, and, yet kind and respectful inquiry. Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom features an exploration of how to talk with one another about significant, even

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All Episodes

01:22:11

S4E1 - A Table Talk on School Choice with Sen....

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2026/01/06

Stephen Owens was Lamar & Tom’s first guest on Getting to 3rd Space in the first season of the podcast. This week he is our first ever Table Talk guest on the podcast and we talk about school choice.During the first season of our podcast Stephen Owens was representing the 74th District in the Kansas House of Representatives. He served in the Kansas House from 2019 to 2024. In 2025, Stephen was elected to the Kansas Senate and is now serving the 31st Senate District. In another first, Senator

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01:01:02

S3E25 A Holiday Table Talk and Season 3 Wrap Up

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/12/23

About this EpisodeIn this holiday-themed episode, Tom and Lamar reflect on their experiences and traditions surrounding December holidays. They share personal stories about their favorite holiday memories, gift-giving practices, and the role of pets in their lives. The conversation also highlights memorable moments from the podcast season and their plans for the future. Whatever holidays you celebrate and however you celebrate them, Lamar, Tom, Jake, and Ebie wish you the warmth of food, friends,

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01:09:01

S3E24 - A Conversation with Michael Gaskins

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/12/09

About this EpisodeMichael Gaskins is a Philadelphian by birth and heart. In fact, he’ll take a soft, chewy Philly pretzel anytime over cookies. He began his career in television production with CBS, NBC, and CNN affiliates but has found himself drawn to work with incarcerated young men to help them prepare for their re-entry into society as citizens upon their release. For a time he operated a prison ministry to do that work and worked with Prison Fellowship (https://www.prisonfellowship.org/) as an

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01:12:06

S3E23 - A Table Talk on Acts of Kindness and...

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/11/25

This week is Thanksgiving in the United States and Lamar & Tom take time to celebrate by sharing acts of kindness submitted by listeners and viewers over the last two months.Since August 2025, Lamar & Tom have been collecting responses to two questions about acts of kindness. The first is, “What is an act of kindness you’ve received that made a difference to you?” The second is “What is an act of kindness you have done which you hope changed another person’s life?” In today’s episode they

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00:54:46

S3E22 - Part 2 - A Conversation with Christie Vilsack

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/11/11

This episode of Getting to 3rd Space is Part 2 of our conversation with Christie Vilsack, writer, teacher, Former First Lady of Iowa, and sponsor of the Navy’s U.S.S. Iowa, a nuclear submarine. Our conversation continues with a focus on literacy, acts of kindness, and the benefits of growing up in rural America. Christie writes the Substack column, “Common Ground,” in which she tells stories of the people she has met and the ties that connect them. A link to her Substack is provided below. This

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00:48:51

S3E21 - Part 1 of A Conversation with Christie Vilsack

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/10/28

Today’s guest on Getting to 3rd Space is Christie Vilsack. She describes herself as a "Teacher, writer, wife, mom and gramma. Proud Iowa first lady, congressional candidate, and USAID education advisor. A world traveler but an Iowan by birth and choice. I write about people living close to the land, who believe in community and the public good. I tend to favor underdogs.” She is also the sponsor of the U.S.S. Iowa, a nuclear submarine commissioned earlier this year.This podcast is Part 1 of 2

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01:01:15

S3E20 Too Much Culture War, Not Enough Kitchen Table

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/10/14

Lamar and Tom talk with Senator Ethan Corson about his decision to run for Governor the State of Kansas. Ethan emphasizes the importance of bipartisan leadership and staying focused on the everyday issues that matter to families. He shares insights on maintaining civility in political campaigns, the significance of community colleges, and his vision for making Kansas an affordable state. Throughout the discussion, Ethan Corson highlights the value of kindness and mentorship in politics as he

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00:39:04

S3E19 Live on Tape from Frederick, MD

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/09/29

About this EpisodeWhat happens when two Hawkeyes get together in person? Well, there are some are stupid jokes as well as good conversation. Join Lamar & Tom for a Getting to 3rd Space episode from Tom's home studio. Lamar Roth and Tom Klaus recorded this episode in person in Tom’s Frederick, Maryland home studio. They talked about Lamar’s experience with a new (and very small) camper he and his spouse used to camp en route from Kansas. Lamar pulls off a golf joke with Tom and Tom flubs a

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01:13:20

S3E18 - A Conversation with Stan "The Man" Martin

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/09/15

What is the power in a name? How do you have challenging conversations about difficult to break personal habits, even addiction? These are just a couple of things discussed in today’s Getting to 3rd Space with Lamar & Tom. In this conversation, Stan “The Man” Martin discusses his extensive work in community engagement and public health, particularly focusing on the fight against menthol tobacco. Stan is a native son of Buffalo, NY where he continues to live and work today. In this interview he

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00:53:00

S3E17 - A Labor Day Table Talk and Three Things We...

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/09/01

It’s Labor Day! But how much do you really know about it? Take Tom’s Labor Day quiz with Lamar and learn three other things they think you need to know. In this engaging Table Talk, Tom Klaus and Lamar Roth explore the significance of Labor Day, the challenges facing the agricultural sector as harvest looms, and the implications of current political trends. They discuss the origins of Labor Day, the serious issues surrounding workers' rights, and the impact of tariffs on grain storage. The

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01:10:10

S3E16 - A Conversation with Joolz Casey

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/08/18

What if…the world were a kinder place? What would it look like? What would it feel like? How would a kinder world begin? Lamar and Tom talk with Joolz Casey, the founder of #behumankind about these and other questions. In this episode Joolz Casey introduces the #behumankind movement, which promotes kindness and empathy as essential components of living a fulfilling life. The discussion also touches on the significance of community care, the impact of language on perceptions of kindness, and the

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01:05:21

S3E15 - Promises, Promises, and More Promises

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/08/04

In this engaging conversation, Tom Klaus and Lamar Roth share their weekend experiences, discuss the art of civil discourse, and delve into various topics including sports, technology, and political promises. They explore the nuances of disagreement, particularly around golf as a sport, the Apple vs. Microsoft debate, and a review of Trump's campaign promises, especially regarding immigration policies. Throughout the discussion, they emphasize the importance of finding common ground and

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00:49:18

S3E14.5 - It's a Throwback Episode!

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/07/21

This throwback episode takes us back to Episode 7 in Season 3, when, on April Fools’ Day eve, Lamar and Tom had a bit of fun with some of the odd but true stories in the news. Hey, it’s still a heavy world right now and we still need an occasional break. We chose this as a throwback episode because it has been the most widely watched, downloaded, and listened to so far this season. Enjoy again…or for the first time.Learn more: News stories that inspired today’s show: The price of eggs is coming

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00:53:28

S3E14 - Table Talk on What it Means to be Patriotic

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/07/07

If you are a listener from the United States, how patriotic do you feel at this time? Did you celebrate the 4th of July with enthusiasm and gusto or with an eye roll and a mumbled “Meh!”? In this conversation, we reflect on the significance of the 4th of July and explore the concept of patriotism. We discuss personal experiences related to Independence Day, the meaning of patriotism in contemporary society, and the importance of acknowledging both the positive and negative aspects of American

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01:00:55

S3E13 A Table Talk on How NOT to Have a Civil Dialogue

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/06/23

In just a few weeks, we’ll celebrate the two year anniversary of the start of this podcast and we’ll be approaching our 50th episode. It seems like a good time for us to take a step back and remember why we are doing this podcast and what we hope to accomplish with it. In this episode, Lamar touchbase with the foundation of Getting to 3rd Space.Learn more: Juneteenth: Sun, Sounds and the Spirit of Freedom (National Museum of African American History & Culture)

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01:20:00

S3E12 A View from the Farm with Allen Schrag

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/06/09

Lamar and Tom welcome Allen Schrag, an innovative Kansas farmer and business person with a lifetime of experience in farming. In this conversation, they discuss the current state of agriculture, comparing it to the 1980s farm crisis, and explore the risks and challenges faced by farmers today. Allen, and his son Paul, operate Silver Creek Farms where they utilize an array of innovative farming techniques, including the use of biologicals to enhance crop production and to maintain soil health for

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01:16:52

S3E11 - Navigating Politics When in a Significant...

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/05/26

In this conversation, District 7 Kansas State Senator Ethan Corson discusses his background, career, and the importance of civil dialogue in politics. He shares insights on navigating a Republican supermajority in the Senate, the differences between federal and state politics, and the significance of communication and listening skills in legislative processes. Ethan Corson emphasizes the need for respectful conversations and the role of civil dialogue in preserving democracy, while also reflecting

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00:56:11

S3E10 States Rights vs Federal Rights

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/05/12

The Constitution has been the guiding document for the United State of America for nearly 250 years. The documents cover a wide range of issues which make it possible for people in a large, diverse country to live peacefully and harmoniously, most of the time. One of the important topics it addresses is the issue of which powers are “reserved” for States and which powers are “enumerated” for Federal government. Of course, it is not always so clear. In this episode, Lamar Roth and Tom Klaus discuss

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01:00:20

S3E9 - What Does it Mean to "Buy American"?

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/04/28

Do you “buy American?” If so, what does that mean? Does it mean you “buy American” all of the time? Does it mean you purchase only those items that are both sourced and manufactured in the United States? Or, does it mean you purchase items that are “made in the USA” but with materials that come from outside the country? What about services?To “buy American” may not be as easy as it once was, with or without tariffs. In today’s podcast Lamar and Tom talk about their experiences of buying American,

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00:46:52

S2E8 - Truth, Truthiness, and Not So Truthy...

Getting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom ·

2025/04/14

Civil conversations and dialogue are made more difficult when participants are not speaking honestly, are simply parroting the ideas of others, or are unwilling to consider being changed through dialogue. In this episode, Lamar and Tom talk about conversations in which truth is illusive, and truthiness is not valued.Learn more: The work of Alan Yarborough and his organization, Habits of Discourse, was part of the inspiration of this episode:https://www.habitsofdiscourse.com/How We Check

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